How to sell to corporate customers

What are the best strategies to sell to corporate customers? After helping +1.000 startups to grow and scale their business, Lode Uytterschaut founder of Start it @KBC joins the show to explain working sales strategies for start-ups and scale-ups.

The best strategy to sell to corporate customers

Michael Humblet:
Welcome to The Sales Acceleration Show. My name is Michael Humblet and I’m the founder of Chaomatic. And in this show we talk, speak, tell you everything to scale your business. And today we have a very special guest, Lode. Maybe you explain first what you do before I start asking you some tough questions.

Lode U.:
My name is Lode. I’m the founder and CEO of Start it @KBC. Started five years ago as a small incubator, but then we shifted and scaled ourselves now to the biggest accelerator in Belgium. We have six locations in Belgium and four in other countries.

Michael Humblet:
Cool. And one of the big topics because we keep talking about is selling to large corporates.

Lode U.:
Of course.

Michael Humblet:
So today my friends, we’re going to talk about selling to large corporates. Maybe you first say the real problem because you talk to all these startups, you talk to all the founders, and it’s always the same thing. They need … I’m not going to say it. You can say it. What do they need Lode?

Lode U.:
Yeah, what do they need? First thing is what do those corporates need? And are you talking to the right people?

Michael Humblet:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Lode U.:
And if you talk to corporates as a startup, let’s just separate scaleups and startups first.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah, yeah, of course.

Lode U.:
If you talk to, and that is a bit our advice to startups. If you want to sell to corporates, think again. If you’re a scaleup and you want to sell to corporates, then there is a big chance that you actually might succeed. If you’re a startup and you want to sell to corporates and you’re selling in their core business, it won’t probably work.

Michael Humblet:
Because they don’t trust you probably.

Lode U.:
Because you’re too small, because the risk is too high, losing image of the corporate is too high. And that’s a natural thing because usually you’re not big enough.

Michael Humblet:
Should the strategy be that you wait until you get big enough until they come to you?

Lode U.:
Yes.

Michael Humblet:
Would that be because-

Lode U.:
Well, yeah. If they know where to find you, yes. But the thing is, if you’re a scaleup, then it’s not about the idea. It’s not about the product. It’s about how far you are and how successful you’re already been as a scaleup. Usually you will have 100,000, 10,000, I don’t know, customers, users. You’ll have your product that’s been validated. You’ve had a funding, or you’ve grown organically into 15, 20, 25, 50 people. So corporates at that point cannot catch up anymore.

Michael Humblet:
And then you become their engine of … motivation. Innovation.

Lode U.:
Innovation.

Michael Humblet:
And motivation of course.

Lode U.:
Yeah. Yeah. So that’s why. We know a lot of corporates of course. Some of them are big customers of our sponsors. There are very few ideas that I’ve seen that startups have that aren’t already on the shelf in those big corporates. You have to understand as a startup that those big corporates, they have thousands of people working with their customers every day. And if you are targeting those same customers, chances are big that they already thought of your idea. But the thing is, it’s not about the idea. It’s about execution.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah, operationally.

Lode U.:
Yeah. And that’s why, and that’s a point where a lot of corporates fail because they don’t know how to put it in the market quickly, they don’t know how to validate it.

Michael Humblet:
The speed, yeah.

Lode U.:
And the speed and the lean approach.

Michael Humblet:
And the knowledge actually, the beat.

Lode U.:
And the knowledge. And the entrepreneurial mindset.

Michael Humblet:
Exactly.

Lode U.:
Because if you are a startup and you fail or you go to market and you make a mistake, it’s not that bad. You’re a startup. It’s not that bad to make mistakes because people know you’ll learn. But if you’re a corporate, you got your image to protect.

Michael Humblet:
You can’t make mistakes.

Lode U.:
You can’t afford to make a mistake because people say, “Whoa, image of that corporate, we expect them to have good products that work and are secure and stuff,” and if things go wrong there, corporates don’t want to take a risk of losing there. Yeah. That’s why we also have a program now to do corporate venturing.

Michael Humblet:
It’s you flip it around actually.

Lode U.:
Yeah, we flip it around, so they can make [inaudible 00:04:32]

Michael Humblet:
Can I pull you back? I want to look at two things here. I want to quick first and talk about startups like the early startups, and then the scaleups, a bit of strategy. One of the things I see when I teach these guys and when I help these guys, I always see the same thing happening, is that one, their pricing is completely off, it’s way too cheap for the value they give. Right?

Lode U.:
Oh yeah.

Michael Humblet:
Two, they actually always end up in the … with the head of innovation or one of these parts within a large corporate. And I’ve seen that it’s really bad to sell to because they’re geared towards innovation. They’re not interested in rolling it out. I mean, I just wanted to know your opinion.

Lode U.:
You have three things actually there, is first the person who you talk to. The other thing is the pricing. And the third thing I forgot. But there are, there will be-

Michael Humblet:
That’s a good start.

Lode U.:
That’s a good start. Let’s start with those other two, but there will be a third.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah.

Lode U.:
Yeah. You can because you’re a sales expert.

Michael Humblet:
I’m listening. I’m listening. I’m learning actually.

Lode U.:
Yeah, really? Cool.

Michael Humblet:
I think you’re doing well Lode.

Lode U.:
Well, thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you Michael. There we go again.

Lode U.:
If you are talking to a SME, you’re probably talk to the owner of an SME, someone who founded the company. So you do an emotional selling. You say, what? Because that guy has been where you are as a startup, he has been there like 5 or 10 years ago. So he wants to help and all that. Corporate is totally different. You have an SME. Then you have bigger corporates. And bigger corporates you do the educational selling where you don’t talk to the owner yourself but …

Michael Humblet:
You’re in the middle and …

Lode U.:
Yeah, you talk to the middle guy who has to sell your product to the owners.

Michael Humblet:
So create the material for his boss or her boss. That’s the key thing they always miss. Yes?

Lode U.:
Yes.

Michael Humblet:
I agree.

Lode U.:
So you have to educate the other guy to sell for you. But in a corporate, you don’t know as a startup what their real pain is. And the thing is, they don’t either. So if you talk to people. Yeah, they meet each other at the coffee machine. There you do a political selling.

Lode U.:
So you have to make sure you talk to the right people within that corporate who at a given moment could meet each other and say, “Well, look, I’ve met that guy.” “Oh yeah. I’ve met them too.” “Oh, maybe we could do a project together.” If you don’t have that, it’s very hard to sell. And usually it’s a guy from procurement, usually it’s people from IT in a big corporate because what startups always forget is that if they sell software, it needs to be implemented and you always need to pass through IT. And there are people who say, “Well, but that doesn’t run on Windows.”

Michael Humblet:
Do you have this feature, feature, have you tested, and you’re dead.

Lode U.:
Yeah. Or their operational system doesn’t support it.

Michael Humblet:
Add to that the legal side.

Lode U.:
Yeah. That’s the third party.

Michael Humblet:
That’s number three.

Lode U.:
That’s number three. But usually startups go and talk to the business. And business is usually enthusiastic about them, about their product.

Michael Humblet:
But don’t they have the budget? The fundamental budget is laying with …

Lode U.:
Yeah, they have … That was the third thing. If you talk to the right people.

Michael Humblet:
Three and a half.

Lode U.:
The right people is not always the decision maker, but also the one who has the budget. Really you have to make sure that you need that upfront because some corporates are really friendly, friendly organizations, but are really friendly, helpful people, and they say, “Yeah, we want to see you. Sure. Come.”

Michael Humblet:
But it’s brain picking, huh?

Lode U.:
But it’s not only brain picking, but they want to be friendly with you. They want to have a meeting with you to listen to what you have to say. But actually they’re not willing to do anything with it.

Michael Humblet:
No. True.

Lode U.:
But they …

Michael Humblet:
I agree.

Lode U.:
They’re like, “Okay. Come over and we’ll have a meeting and we’ll-

Michael Humblet:
And then if you potentially would sell something, you have a sale cycle of 12 months, 18 months, sometimes is really long, and that’s where I see a lot of pipelines go horribly wrong. They’re all waiting. “Yeah, we’ve got the meeting, big party.” I said, “No, no, endorphins have to come when something’s signed, which is like 12 months down the road. You don’t have time for that.”

Lode U.:
Yes. And the thing is, once you talk to a corporate, and I’m not saying these are bad organizations or bad people. It’s just the way they’re structured.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah, I agree.

Lode U.:
And they’re all good will. They all have … They all want to help.

Lode U.:
But pricing, pricing is something that a lot of startups don’t do right because they don’t take into account the effort it takes to get it implemented. So if you talk to a corporate, they see problems that you don’t see. You as a startup-

Michael Humblet:
You cannot even imagine. You can’t even imagine the problem, yeah.

Lode U.:
So you are coming with your product, with your solution. What the corporate sees, “Fuck, we have to implement it. We have to train our people. We have to … ” So they see problem, problem, problem, problem. So they see, this is going to take time, this is going to take … And we have to put it on one roadmap or two roadmap. We have to do education or we … Hell.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah.

Lode U.:
You don’t know that as a startup.

Michael Humblet:
No.

Lode U.:
So they will ask you to do it. And if your pricing is low, you’re dead.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah, I agree.

Lode U.:
So that’s why some SaaS companies, they say, “Well, we’re going to sell license, but we’re going to sell consulting too to get it implemented.” And usually the implementation budget is …

Michael Humblet:
Yeah. And then I, a lot of things that I see is a lot of large corporates don’t want the SaaS. They basically on their bookkeeping, the way they do bookkeeping, they want the capex cost, they want the services. And they move away the SaaS while the SaaS is their equity value, that makes the company obviously because it’s recurrent.

Lode U.:
Yeah. Well, and also, and that was something I wanted to add is … Yeah, well, that’s typical for SaaS of course, that if you have, if you’re a startup, you think, well, it’s software so we can lower the price because we want to put that logo on our website, we want to-

Michael Humblet:
That’s a bad idea.

Lode U.:
That’s a bad idea because actually idea that you put into the heads of those people you’re talking to, is if you, you’re too cheap, so there’s no way you can serve-

Michael Humblet:
Something must be wrong.

Lode U.:
Something must be wrong or for … Okay, you’re selling this for €50 or €100 a month. No way that if we have a problem that you can service us for €100 a month. That’s just not possible. So we have-

Michael Humblet:
But I also-

Lode U.:
Yeah, but we have startups, we had startups actually who for exactly the same product, went to a corporate, they tried to sell it for €150. Corporate didn’t trust them because of the low price and said no. And then they went back after three months and they have … and they did their pricing I think times 15 and then it was okay. No problem to sign.

Michael Humblet:
The other thing I do see with corporate sometimes is that they do the opposite game. You say you would come in with a decent price. It’s 100K. And then a lot of startups by the way, they’re not used to these type of amounts. I see that a lot. They get scared and they get really nervous and you have to find a way to price. By the way, you have to find a way to price your product 100k. It’s a very good exercise to do. And it’s not just one thing that you sell more. No, you have to find other models to do it. And then the corporate says, “Yeah, but you’re a startup. You can do this for 10k. I only have a budget of 10k.” That’s another problem I see a lot.

Lode U.:
Yeah, that’s another problem.

Michael Humblet:
It’s the opposite one. And then you know you’re in trouble because it means for me that you’re never going to touch the hierarchy, right? Because the 100k needs to go up to the guy’s boss to sign and 10k he has his own budget and then you’re in this trap. You can’t escape.

Lode U.:
The thing is if you are a scaleup, you determine your roadmap. If you’re a startup, the corporate will determine your roadmap.

Michael Humblet:
That is a nice statement.

Lode U.:
Yeah. And it’s normal because you’re not secure enough. You give them the oppression. Yeah, but we need you dear corporate to actually validate our product. They will say, “Well okay, we can validate it if you change it a bit like this.”

Michael Humblet:
Which is a pain and a problem.

Lode U.:
Yes. The next corporate will say, “Well okay, if we change it a bit like this,” and before you know what you’re doing custom stuff.

Michael Humblet:
I wanted to say because I made a note Lode, sometimes I make some, because your 0.5 that you haven’t touched yet is the whole customization point. A corporate it’s like if they give you money, they want the exact color they want it. And I think it’s big trap. You have to be really, really careful. So I fully agree. For once in our lifetime we agree to agree.

Lode U.:
We agree to stuff.

Michael Humblet:
So let’s jump to scaleups. I think you nailed the startups pretty good actually. So I’m now curious of scaleups, because for me, scaleups, they … Let me start there. They actually do one thing wrong sometimes. They have the attention. Then they get the trust. People then think, “Oh these guys could do it. They’ve multiple clients. They know what they’re talking about. Sounds good. Innovative. Not too disruptive. Not too much friction.” And then they forget, for me, always a fundamental thing that is explaining, I call it the structure slide, that is explaining this is how we work. It’s one, two, three. It’s easy. We got you covered. And they forget it. And then you add a lot of friction.

Michael Humblet:
And I’ve seen a lot of executives, they calm their mind when they say, “Okay, they have done it before. There is a process.” And I see a lot of scaleups forgetting that. What else do you see? I mean, do you agree?

Lode U.:
Yes, I agree. Of course, I agree Michael.

Michael Humblet:
Yes, thank you Lode.

Lode U.:
So we both agree on something.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah. Second time.

Lode U.:
Yeah, one, one. Yeah. What else do I see is that if you’re a scaleup and you’re talking to a corporate, you want to sell to a corporate, it’s still is a difference between are you selling core, something, the core business for the corporate or not. If you are not selling something core business, then chances are big that you will … The sale cycle will be like one month, maybe two weeks, whatever. It’s possible. Big corporates, they do events. If you are an event scaleup and you sell software, a matching app or whatever, chances are bigger. They say, “Okay, we do 1,400 events. You can do 100. And let’s just check it.”

Michael Humblet:
But then the amounts will never be high.

Lode U.:
The amount will never be high. But it’s okay just to sell. But you don’t see the big strategic things there.

Michael Humblet:
Advantage.

Lode U.:
If it’s core, and by the way, even startups can sell at that level to corporates. We’ve seen it many times. If it’s non core. But if it’s core, then it’s something else. Then a corporate will usually also think about can we do something more with that than only distribute.

Michael Humblet:
And why would that be because it’s easier to get it approved all the way up?

Lode U.:
If it’s core business it’s core business. Then, yeah, if you’re a fintech and you want to sell to KBC or another bank, well, then you’re in their core business. So I don’t believe that those corporates will ever say, “Well here is our customer base.”

Michael Humblet:
Have fun.

Lode U.:
Yeah, have fun with it.

Michael Humblet:
It’d be very naïve. Can you just send me all your emails?

Lode U.:
I know. They will try to build a partnership with you or they will try to buy you or take a stake or …

Michael Humblet:
What about exclusivity? That’s classic one I see coming up.

Lode U.:
I always say with exclusivity, try to limit it in time.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah. I add geography by the way.

Lode U.:
Raise your price. Raise your price a little bit with time.

Michael Humblet:
Double it. Yeah. I have this very nice example of approximates actually. They all wanted exclusivity and we said, “Okay, you can have it for one year only on Belgium.” And so time, geography, and then I said, “And the price is going to be three times aside because you stopped me from the market,” and they said, “No, no, it was just a question, Michael.” So I believe in saying yes and then give it-

Lode U.:
Yeah, it’s … Yeah, it can be a really disadvantage to give actually if it is a big strategic decision to make. And don’t make those decisions overnight. Talk to people about it, because it can really limit your growth.

Michael Humblet:
The other thing I sometimes see is-

Lode U.:
Or I can boost your growth.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah, yeah.

Lode U.:
But you have to, yeah.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah. Yeah, if you have the big names. The other thing I see sometimes I call it the friction part where you’re a scaleup and you go to a large corporate and then they ask you, “Okay, make me a quote.” And then it takes them two weeks to make the quote because they never really thought it through and they don’t know what to do with pricing. And then it always ends up the same thing. As soon as one of these guys phones me, says, “Michael, what do you think? 50 or 80k?” “Well, hang on, hang on, hang on. It’s not going to work like this.” But you need a proper strategy there. So this being fast and keeping the momentum I think is absolute key.

Michael Humblet:
Also, focusing on the next step. What I think most companies do wrong when they try to sell is, they only, they think they can close it straight away. No, your step is, I need to get to the next meeting. Keep the momentum flowing.

Lode U.:
Yeah. Yeah. But followup for very, very, very good and very hard.

Michael Humblet:
So how do you manage the political landscape? Because I think that’s also a very, very difficult one. So imagine you’re the stakeholder and I need to get … I mean, I would say you need to talk to everybody. You need to get above because I think that’s always a very tricky one. Would you pick up the phone and phone the CEO or how? Because it’s tricky because the guy you’re talking to feels like you’re betraying him, you’re-

Lode U.:
If you’re a startup or a scaleup and-

Michael Humblet:
Let’s take both.

Lode U.:
Yeah. And I’m the stakeholder from the corporates. I’ll try to assess what’s in it for me. How can I be in the picture? In real life I’m not like that. But just suppose that. How can I be in the picture? How can I present myself? How can I make a good deal out of it? How can I? So how can I ease my work? Because sometimes, and that’s sometimes a mistake that what you don’t know always know as a startup or a scaleup, you talk to a person where you’re actually going to make their job obsolete. And that’s not your-

Michael Humblet:
Typically startups are very naïve that they kind of go in and would save you …

Lode U.:
That’s not your best promoter.

Michael Humblet:
No, no, no, no. That’s-

Lode U.:
No, that’s not your best promoter. You have to imagine it like a corporate, is like a city, and you have to walk the right streets and go into the right buildings, and talk to the right people. But in order to … And that’s why the sales cycle is usually so long. You don’t know who the right people are from beginning. That’s sometimes why accelerators are there, because they have a network within those partners-

Michael Humblet:
They put you in front of the right guy and …

Lode U.:
Yeah, they can …

Michael Humblet:
And then it’s a question of value proper. You have to say the right things and the revenue up and cut cost. It’s always something like that.

Lode U.:
Yeah. But that’s something else. You have to know what the pain of those corporates are. And usually it’s, okay, we can build up your reputation or your image. We can as an innovative company for example. Or you will get press out of it. Or we can-

Michael Humblet:
But that’s not really strong. I wouldn’t spend 100k for that.

Lode U.:
No, no, no, something add-on. What’s really important, we can lower your risk. We can add IP or shareholder value, or we can raise your revenue, stuff like that.

Michael Humblet:
Talking about IP because I think that’s something that always comes back, and you must be experienced in the meantime, is a lot of these corporates, want a piece of IP, so they’ll say, “If you sell to me, you’re actually developing a part of your solution based on my requisite. So basically you will create IP based on my knowledge.” What’s your answer because it’s a tough one? It’s also a very dangerous discussion.

Lode U.:
There again, I think if you’re a startup, your negotiation strength is lower than when you’re a scaleup.

Michael Humblet:
Would you do it? Would you do that?

Lode U.:
What? Give my IP?

Michael Humblet:
Do you advise them to do? Yeah?

Lode U.:
No.

Michael Humblet:
No, meaning I would say, “Sorry. No, we don’t do that.”

Lode U.:
No.

Michael Humblet:
And then the other thing, co-creation. That’s the answer to, “No real IP. Okay, let’s do co-creation. And no, yeah, but … ” You guys, I mean, let’s take a bank [inaudible 00:21:23]. They’re just not set up to do these kinds of construction because then you have to do revenue share. It’s just so difficult to set up.

Lode U.:
It’s difficult to set up.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah, that’s the problem. It’s never really going … And then again, you have different stakeholders.

Lode U.:
And you have to make those agreements upfront and you say, “Well, let’s go create something together.” Usually you have an innovative party, a not innovative party, and a customer. Customer kind of. And they work together around the problem that that customer has and what whatnot, and that the non-innovative party has detected, and they’re looking for an innovative party, a startup, a scaleup to …

Michael Humblet:
Make it sexy.

Lode U.:
Make it sexy and to actually even build it if they can’t. Yeah. Depending on the strength of each of those parties, you can make an arrangement. Usually customers don’t get anything because they want their problem to get solved. That’s a win for them. Then the corporate can have, they can have a new product and the startup or a scaleup can have a distribution model. So if that’s value for both of them, you’d just make an agreement on that. But IP is something really difficult to … Yeah, then you need a fourth party is big lawyer.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah, and then it’s going to cost you a fortune.

Lode U.:
Yeah, to structure it all. Usually the partners that we work with, they say, “Well, if we work with startups and we do something together, they own the IP.”

Michael Humblet:
Yeah. I also think-

Lode U.:
And I think it’s valuable.

Michael Humblet:
Is the only way and you’ll get a lot of discount on certain pricing. You can do other arrangements so that at least probably become stronger.

Lode U.:
Yeah. The other thing also for the corporates that our customers have started for example, all our partners or experts, they sign a contract where they can’t claim IP.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah. Smart.

Lode U.:
Yeah. So corporate knows, “Well, if we develop a corporate venture or whatever and we work with Start it, it’s IP,” so.

Michael Humblet:
Like you’re protecting the … You’re like the chicken sitting on the … protecting.

Lode U.:
I’m a chicken, yes.

Michael Humblet:
You are the chicken. I thought so this morning.

Michael Humblet:
So as we are near the end, let me ask you some really …

Lode U.:
Now you can talk to my front end. I’m a chicken.

Michael Humblet:
So let me ask you some chicken question Lode because I know you’re in a very, very changing agile environments. A lot of pivoting going around and things change all the time. So how do you focus you as a person? How do you know what to do and what not to do and push away?

Lode U.:
How do I focus? For me, it’s sometimes very hard to focus because, like you say, you see a lot of opportunities and I’m a yes guy. So, yeah, I get energy from doing new stuff.

Michael Humblet:
Our previous guest, you know what he said? I really liked it. I have other people to fix this. I just need to run.

Lode U.:
No. No, no. Yeah. I have to learn. I had to learn to focus more. Yeah, because then if you run alone, then you’re alone.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah. No, no, true.

Lode U.:
Nothing happens.

Michael Humblet:
True.

Lode U.:
And like I said before, it’s not about the idea, it’s about execution. Started as a team thing. Yeah. So everybody has great ideas, and I don’t want to be the only one to have them. So if you sometimes take a step back in your spaghetti hat, other ideas come up that are usually far more valuable.

Michael Humblet:
So where then do you get your inspiration?

Lode U.:
I read a lot. I look. I watch-

Michael Humblet:
Can I ask? Is it-

Lode U.:
Star Trek.

Michael Humblet:
Is it business books then?

Lode U.:
No. Hell no.

Michael Humblet:
Once I get done overdose sometimes I don’t want to read.

Lode U.:
No, no, no, no.

Michael Humblet:
So not Star Wars. Star Trek.

Lode U.:
Yeah, Star Trek, yeah.

Michael Humblet:
Okay. Science fiction.

Lode U.:
Yeah. Well, yeah.

Michael Humblet:
I am a big fan by the way, so.

Lode U.:
Yeah, I like Star Trek and all those things. That’s how I unwind as well. Just run away-

Michael Humblet:
Escape literature as they call it.

Lode U.:
Escape. Yeah, but the literature, it’s usually about other people. So their story fascinates me. The last one I read was about or from Richard Branson, finding my virginity, I read lost … losing my virginity.

Michael Humblet:
Just the title you thought, “Hm”.

Lode U.:
Yeah, finding my. So how do you do that? And he found his virginity. No, but it’s a nice book because you had … He’s who he is, but I think he’s really a great example of an entrepreneur. He’s also a yes person I guess. So yeah, let’s make a aviation company. Okay. Fine. Let’s buy Virgin Airlines.

Michael Humblet:
So what do you think is-

Lode U.:
It’s always great.

Michael Humblet:
What do you think is your biggest mistake you’ve done you said, “I’m never going to do that again. That was really wrong”?

Lode U.:
Oh, the biggest mistake to make. Yeah, like I said the first time we tried this interview …

Michael Humblet:
You have to know, it’s the second time we try it, yeah. We kept telling really bad jokes and then we couldn’t air them. So we had said, “Let’s do something really serious,” and I think you’re doing well.

Lode U.:
About cows and …

Michael Humblet:
Yeah.

Lode U.:
You actually know a great joke about … No.

Michael Humblet:
What’s the biggest mistake you’ve made, the stuff you think really I should …

Lode U.:
The biggest, biggest mistake is while setting up Start it going like too many chips in, and then putting family aside without actually doing this. But you just grow into, yeah, you say yes to a lot of things. You try to build something up.

Michael Humblet:
Work, work, work, yeah.

Lode U.:
Work, work a lot, events, late at night and say yes to everything and go and speak everywhere. And then do … Yeah. So at a given moment, yeah, then, if you lose the family. And actually those people are there when you’re in deep shit, for example, they’re the ones, so they’re the most important ones in your life. So I always also to startups who work 27 hours a day-

Michael Humblet:
Find a balance-

Lode U.:
… and they brag about it, I say, “Okay, that’s great if you work that much, but you’ll hit a wall if you don’t keep your friends and especially your family close.” Yeah. Because one other thing is that average age within Start It is 32, so that means that a lot of-

Michael Humblet:
It’s older than I thought.

Lode U.:
Yeah. So it’s not the school students stop with education and then let’s see if we can be a startup as a service or startup as a status actually, the new SaaS. But those are people who are, they’re leaving a job behind. They have usually families. So living on one of the two …

Michael Humblet:
Income, yeah.

Lode U.:
Income, house, children. Yeah, they have a lot to lose.

Michael Humblet:
Yeah. But they tend to work and they go for it. Yeah.

Lode U.:
Yeah. Therefore, I mean, you need a lot of convincing to get those families aboard, on board and keep them on board. So it’s very important to really have a good relationship and a good understanding and a good communication channel with the home front.

Michael Humblet:
Perfect. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. I think it was a really good deep dive on selling to corporates. Very valuable. So if you want to know more, give it a thumbs up, subscribe to the channel. And I’m pretty sure we see Lode again for a fourth or fifth session. Thank you.